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Agenda and minutes

Public Toilets (Lion Yard) Working Party
Monday, 19th March, 2012 11.30 am

Venue: Committee Room 1 & 2 - Guildhall. View directions

Contact: Glenn Burgess  01223 457169

No. Item




Apologies were submitted from Cllr Reid and Janet Griffiths. 


Declarations of Interest

Members are asked to declare at this stage any interests that they may have in an item shown on this agenda. If any member is unsure whether or not they should declare an interest on a particular matter, they should seek advice from the Head of Legal Services before the meeting. 





Personal: As a member of the Planning Committee that may be determining any future application.



Minutes of the previous meeting pdf icon PDF 49 KB


The minutes of the meeting held on 9 January 2012 were approved and signed as a correct record. 


Councillor Bird updated the Working Party on difficulty in finding a representative from Camsight on behalf of the visually impaired community to contribute.  However she suggested that a relation of Janet Griffiths,  (Joyce Richardson) who is registered blind, could feed in to the Working Party’s deliberations.  The Working Party agreed with Councillor Bird’s suggestion.


Public Questions

(See information below)  




Update Report on Working Party's remit pdf icon PDF 31 KB

Additional documents:


The Director of Resources introduced the report.  The Working Party was advised that there was no further update on a planning application having been submitted (para 3.1) and the Building Control application was still in the process of being considered by the Council Building Control officers (para 3.2).  The Working Party noted that the fire service was consulted as part of the building regulation application process.


The Working Party considered the updated draft of the Equalities Impact Assessment (EqIA) appended to the report and made the following comments:


1.  In section 12 of the draft EqIA, the reference to ‘does not represent a material disadvantage to users’ was contested – it surely was depending on the user’s point of view.  The Strategy Officer advised that this particular statement had not been part of the revisions made to the draft EqIA since being first reported to Members at Strategy and Resources Scrutiny Committee in July and October 2011.  Members asked if the Council had any context to back the statement up, like user surveys. The Director of Resources commented that there was no evidence giving the starting point of the user’s journey only the direction and agreed a changed route to the toilets would impact differently dependent on  individual circumstances.  Officers would look at how this part of the draft EqIA could be better put in light of the Working Party’s comments.  The Working Party agreed that this re-wording could be commented on via written correspondence between officers and Members and prior to the next meeting.

2.  In section 11, it refers to the disabled toilets being used less than the general facility.  That is because there are less disabled people.  The Strategy Officer agreed to check the context/reference and amend.


In discussing the congestion experienced in the passageway between the Grand Arcade and Fisher Square, the Working Party noted that officers had met with the owners of the Grand Arcade to discuss what could be done to improve through movement (page 23).  The Working Party noted that the Council could not require Grand Arcade to make any improvements, but discussions would continue.


The Working Party discussed the developer’s proposal to close the walkway between Lion Yard and Fisher Square.  The Director of Resources reminded Members that the Council had an obligation to take reasonable steps to support the developer as set out in the Licence previously granted for the work by the Council.  In response to a query for whether the walkway had a name, officers undertook to find out and report back.


The Working Party considered the consultations which would take place (para 3.7).  With regard to the stated requirement that the developer would be expected to consult on the closure of the walkway when applied for, the Chair proposed that the Council should undertake its own survey and consultation activity (with the Working Party’s input) and work with the developer during that time. The Working Party agreed unanimously with the proposal.


The Working Party agreed:


(i)  That officers  ...  view the full minutes text for item 12/29/PTWP


Lion Yard Public Toilet Refurbishment - Project Update pdf icon PDF 27 KB


The Project Manager (Streets and Open Spaces) introduced the report.  The Working Party noted that the report from the structural engineer survey, requested following the Working Party site visit in December and to inform the requirements of any refurbishment, was still awaited and therefore the total estimated cost of the project could not be confirmed.  The Working Party would be notified as soon as possible of the officer assessment.  In response to a question, it was noted that the survey had not considered moving the entrance/exit to the toilets – that would be done at a later time (if required).


The Working Party would be consulted on the Project Initiation Document (the internal document that sets out the refurbishment in more detail) prior to its submission to the Head of Streets and Open Spaces who would approve it.


Resolved by 5 votes to 0 to:


(i) Note progress with the project

(ii) Approve the proposed stages for project delivery


[nb. Cllr Swanson did not vote because of her position as the  Executive Councillor being advised by the Working Party on the matter which is one of its Terms of Reference] 


Date of the next meeting


Provisionally agreed to next meet on 28 May at 1p.m.